“I wish there were also people from the field of soccer participating in democratic initiatives. They are very important public figures and role models,” she said during our Monday Talk interview.
Mansur, an award-winning actress, has participated in many of the demonstrations organized by Genç Siviller (Young Civilians), a Turkish nongovernmental organization noted for its use of sarcasm in its activities. Genç Siviller comprises citizens of diverse backgrounds who have come together to demand increased democracy. Mansur is also part of a group called the Arts Initiative for Peace, a platform supporting the government’s democratic initiative, which intends to expand the rights of the country’s Kurdish population.
Answering our questions, Mansur discussed her career as an activist, which began several years ago.
How would you compare the Turkey of the 1990s with today’s Turkey from an artist’s point of view?
We faced more restrictions in the ’90s, when there was much less talk about Turkey’s problems. Now there is hope for peace in Turkey. We did not have that then.
Would it have been possible to create a television show like “Hatırla Sevgili” [Remember Darling, a series that portrays the political history of Turkey from the end of the 1950s through the military coups in 1960, 1971 and 1980] at that time?
It wouldn’t have been possible. It would be very hard to imagine such productions at that time.
Do you think that is because screenwriters would censor themselves?
Screenwriters would do that knowing that producers would not be interested in producing films dealing with politically problematic issues in Turkey.
How did you become an activist yourself? We see your name associated with many signature campaigns, from 70 million steps against military coup d’états to the Arts Initiative for Peace.
Actually, these are the most recent initiatives I have been involved in. I was tried with [artist] Zuhal [Olcay] many years ago at the State Security Court [DGM], and the case went on for years.
What was the reason for your trial?
It was a case against freedom of thought. We, a large number of artists, would collect articles from writers -- from the left and the right -- who had been tried for the “crime” of freedom of thought. Some of those articles had been banned from being published. But we would collect those articles and publish them in volumes. As publishers, we were about 1,000 people, including prominent writers, painters, actors and actresses. Writer Orhan Pamuk was among us. In a way, we were pushing for a change of the laws preventing freedom of thought as we were provoking the prosecutors either to detain all of us or change the laws.
What happened at the end of that struggle?
We first published those “banned” articles as much as we could. We were a large group of artists, about 1,000 people. Then we divided ourselves into groups of 10 so the work could be expedited. Some of us were tried in courts for publishing those banned works. I remember that a prosecutor at the time demanded a prison sentence of up to 12 years for me.
And you continued publishing?
Yes, we did. During the first court case, the judge said they would call for punishment if the “offense” was repeated again. We immediately published another book. But there was another court case, and then they started to look for “bad intentions” in our action. Prosecutors always found reasons to launch court cases against us. They did not change the laws restricting freedom of thought. We just gave up at some point.
But you haven’t given up completely.
Some of us haven’t given up the fight in general, but we gave up on that project and found other ways to continue that struggle.
What did you do?
I was following the activities of Genç Siviller [Young Civilians]. Their activities attracted my attention especially because there are so few people holding such protests in Turkey. I try to join all their activities.
‘We visited Ceylan Önkol’s family’
What other activities have you been involved in recently?
I recently visited the family of Ceylan Önkol [a 14-year-old girl who was killed in an explosion on Sept. 28 while tending sheep in the southeastern province of Diyarbakır. The General Staff initially denied allegations that a military mortar shell had caused her death. Later, a forensic report found the girl responsible for her own death, stating that she had accidentally detonated an unexploded grenade previously launched by the Turkish Armed Forces (TSK) while playing with it].
It was [modern dance performer] Zeynep Tanbay’s idea. We wanted to visit the family because nobody was doing so. There were nine of us.
How was that experience?
We went to Bingöl from Diyarbakir. We saw the scene of the incident. The place is in a location surrounded by three hills, and on top of those hills are three gendarmerie posts. Let alone a PKK [outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ Party] presence, even birds cannot fly in the area. One of the first official statements had come from the Bingöl governor, who said the girl had stepped on a mine. But Ceylan’s feet and legs were intact. Her face and hands were intact, too. But her torso was in pieces. Apparently, something struck her in the torso. Then some officials said she was a victim of an explosion while she was playing with a foreign explosive object in the field. It simply seems impossible that an intelligent 14-year-old girl like Ceylan who was very successful in school would do such a thing. Following the incident, a prosecutor refused to go to the area on the grounds that his safety would be in danger. This is laughable since there are three gendarmerie posts. Why would they not protect the prosecutor? The village imam was given a camera to take pictures of the scene of the incident. We filed a criminal complaint against the prosecutor and gendarmerie stating they were not doing their jobs well.
What else did you do in the village?
We listened to the family and the other villagers as they told us about the incident.
What did they say?
They said that they first heard a whistling sound and then the sound of an explosion. Apparently, somebody in the area somehow fired at the girl. And the family asks that something should be done about this. They want people to be held accountable for this. No government official visited the family. But another civil society group is planning to visit them.
Did anything in the village surprise you?
I have visited and stayed in many regions of Turkey as I was filming. So I am familiar with the conditions in Turkey’s villages. There was no surprise in that regard. The family feels that they have been insulted because they were told that Ceylan caused her own death. The family knows how smart Ceylan was, and they know that she would not play like a small child. One other thing is that the family’s threshold for pain appears to be very high. If I were Ceylan’s mother, I would be under psychological treatment since she picked the pieces of her child’s body from the branches of trees! And the prosecutor scolded them because they did not bring enough samples of wood and soil from the area!
What is the reason behind your political sensitivity? Does it have anything to do with being an artist?
I don’t think it has to do with being an artist. I am a human being. And it has to do with being human and having a conscience.
What is the Arts Initiative for Peace about?
When we talk about peace in Turkey, it is mostly about the Kurdish issue because the war in Turkey is related to the Kurdish issue. We would like this war to end. In general, our demand is for equal citizenship, not only for the Kurds but for all people living in Turkey. There are revelations that there have even been recent military coup plans in Turkey. It is horrible that we are still being led by people who have the mentality of İttihat ve Terakki [the Committee of Union and Progress] even though the first years of the republic are so far behind us.
Do you think the Kurdish initiative will last?
It is important that some things have started, but we need to see them continue. It was important that a number of PKK members came back to Turkey. We have moved one step forward in that regard. But we also expect that Ceylan’s case will be followed up on. However, so many problems have been swept under the rug since the Ottoman period, and it is hard to sort them out all at once. One other important development is the case against Ergenekon [a clandestine organization nested within state organs and charged with plotting to overthrow the government]. We are waiting for its results. Most importantly, a constitutional change is a must for Turkey, which still has the Constitution of the 1980 military coup era.
‘I am a white Turk’
Your background is different from some people who are considered “others” and not “first-class citizens.” We can say that you come from an elite class.
In today’s terminology, I am called a “white Turk.” When I was born, my father was a 56-year-old general. Then he was 3rd army commander in 1960.
So you are very familiar with the officers’ clubs.
I never liked those places. I actually hated them. Generals had separate entertainment areas that were more luxurious. I was so embarrassed over that discrimination. OK, the military has this hierarchical structure, but why they maintain the rules of chain of command even during vacation or entertainment time that I could not understand. I was embarrassed to have that privilege. I didn’t like it.
You don’t like to be a “white Turk”?
I don’t like it. I don’t like being evaluated in a hierarchical structure. But I was disciplined in a different way. For example, we wouldn’t eat simit [sesame covered bread rings sold on the streets] on the street because my family would tell me that there could be people around who are not able to get them. If I had received an interesting and expensive pen as a present, I wouldn’t be allowed to take it to school because there might be some people who might never be able to get one. We would always think of others.
Something that is not very likely to be seen today.
Yes. This part has to do with empathy. That has helped my career as an actress. I have been able to empathize. Indeed, I wish more artists were activists. But there are only a handful of people like that in Turkey. I wish there were also people from the field of soccer participating in democratic initiatives. They are very important public figures and role models.
And there are a lot of people who wear headscarves in Turkey, and they are not received well by the military.
Not only that, but a mother would likely miss her child’s graduation ceremony from university if she wears a headscarf. This should be unacceptable. Fanatic Kemalists have been doing a great deal of damage to Turkey by making a religion out of Kemalist ideals.
Have you been with “white Turks” who are against people with headscarves?
Yes, I have. When we were working on the freedom of thought issue, we had signatures from women who wear headscarves or their supporters. Some of the activists who call themselves “leftists” abandoned our campaign because they said, “Either us or them.” I was shocked that they would abandon the campaign, which was about freedom of thought, so ironically.
I see that you read the Taraf daily.
Yes. I can find news in there that I cannot find in other dailies. It is not a regular daily. I also like to read their columns.
What type of news are you referring to when you say you cannot find it in other media?
For example, Ceylan’s story, military coup plots, the Dağlıca raid [referring to the alleged intelligence report claiming that the General Staff had prior knowledge of a PKK ambush in late 2007 that left 13 soldiers dead] and so on.
Lale Mansur, prominent dancer, actress and activist
She has been dancing since she was 14. Her career as an artist began with the İstanbul State Opera and Ballet, where she worked as a ballerina for several years. She made her acting debut in “Childhood,” a documentary film about Yaşar Kemal’s life directed by James Runcie. It was produced by BBC television in 1992. During that period, she trained at the Eric Morris Actors Workshop in Los Angeles and took diction lessons in İstanbul. She has received three best actress awards for her roles in “Düş Gezginleri” at the 1992 Antalya Film Festival, “O da Beni Seviyor” at the 2000 Sadri Alışık Awards and “Karşılaşma” at the 2002 Ankara Film Festival. Her most recent film, “Başka Dilde Aşk,” will be in movie theaters in December.
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